Is TV Horology Headed for a Crash?

June 9, 2011

WITH today’s announcement of Renato spinning off their own forum, renatogeeks; and internet TV show, can we expect the world of TV Horology to collapse under it’s diversified weight?

ShopNBC used to be the defacto place to buy brands whose retail presence was secondary to their late night cable appearances on ShopNBC. Fans regularly phish for new products, gaining bragging rights on the WG town square. Filling the huge, empty hole in their souls with easy Value Pays and products selling for a 10th of the retail value. was spun up by a green ShopNBC host who used it to aggregate all of those dispirit fans who routinely got into pissing contests on other forums defending the Invicta brand – this was a fruitopia for those collectors and addicts; both vain and broken.

This model worked well for awhile, like Michael Jackson and Paul McCartney. But then Invicta, who appears to have financed the site for many years, was no longer the king. Invicta quality started to wain and they began replacing the stuff that made them a value and viable brand – using coated mineral crystals and replacing stainless with polymers. Lior of SWI got into the game around this time. Where once he pushed brands that he actually owned the licensing agreement for, like Triumph and Jacques Lemans, he wanted to compete head to head with Invicta and so introduced Swiss Legend. These were “Swiss Movement” watches and Laylo loved to point out that all of his “Swiss” watches were the best value – because they were made in Switzerland. This occurred as better quality Chinese made brands were introduced (Android) and Invicta was beset by one scandal after another; caught lying about materials and having to admit that “Swiss” was actual Chinese.

The one commonality with all the TV brands is that they own no factories. They are a brand with designers who outsource it’s manufacture to the lowest bidder. I’ve seen TV Watch brand fans laugh off Fossil. But brands like Invicta are not even in Fossils league. The company actually takes a lead in quality and works with the suppliers at the manufacturing level to ensure the highest possible quality standards. Go to your local TJ Maxx and compare the two sometime.

WHEN James “No Cut Contract” Skelton replaced Tim Temple, he brought an entirely new demographic to the world of Horology. The Coors Lite; riding motorcycles in shorts and flip flops crowd people who smoked cigars and left the rings on; that drank Chardonnay from a box while wearing shirts with the top 4 buttons undone. These were not watch idiot savants – they was plain fucking idiots.

I’VE suspected that WOW.TV was a reaction to the Invicta Swinese scandal. They had been at a competitive disadvantage with Invicta who was claiming to offer supposed Swiss made watches at the same or lower prices. Always subjected to the Invicta crew of Davis, Lalo, Jill and even Skelton implying that consumers were getting Swiss made. Having handled both Swiss Legend and Invicta, the quality is slightly higher in more of the SWI examples. Surely Lior had handled the competition and realized he was surpassing Invicta but always second fiddle.

By the looks of it, WOW is a success and they are pushing Invicta product as well; sometimes the same product as Shop but far cheaper. Their customer service is legendary and far surpasses the complaints with SNBC and invicta’s CS blackhole.

AFTER the Michael Davis sticky on watchgeeks throwing Daniel Mink under the bus followed a day later with a Mink email blast announcing the planned termination of the WG/Renato relationship and launch of and RenatoTV, two of the five major TV brands are now representing themselves with a major web presence and streaming internet tv shows. Are the remaining few far behind? How will ShopNBC and Invicta fair? Where once it looked as if ShopNBC was becoming THE Invicta channel, they have started to introduce SkyMalls favorite brand, Stauer, as well as a higher profile for Android.

Another competitive factor is Jim Skelton and where he’ll end up in September. Could Android be the next to go solo with Jim at the sales helm pushing Wing’s dreams to the fiends? Or is he headed to JTV as some are claiming and what will that do for the trailer park network and how it competes with ShopNBC?


15 Responses to “Is TV Horology Headed for a Crash?”

  1. Anonymous Says:

    The allure and drawing power of TV still trumps the Internet, which requires more work. The watch shows are in no danger from the Web site casts.
    You actually have to do something to use the worldwide web. It is not a passive experience.
    Most of the consumers targeted by TV watch sales can’t type while holding a beer can. (However, their misguided attempts to do so may explain the spelling errors that permeate their posts.)
    I suspect Daniel “The Mink” Minkowitz Renato Channel is merely sour grapes. The brand is doomed.

  2. betterskills Says:

    You’re not considering the trend of smartphones that are slowly making TV irrelevant. A full 97% of my online activity is an iPhone or one of my old iPhones being use a an Internet browser. As ShopNBC loses it’s core brands and replaces them with Millionsmart clones, one has to wonder when the consumer turns away because everything looks the same – think Detroit 1979.

  3. sandoz Says:

    Betterskills wrote: “…two of the five major TV brands are now representing themselves with a major web presence and streaming internet tv shows. Are the remaining few far behind How will ShopNBC and Invicta fair?”
    I find it a lot easier to flip on TV to see watch shows than following them on line. My TV is always on but not so my computer. So if i hear something interesting i go see whats up. Im not very techwise and I dont spend as much time as some others online. Ive never once went to wow or swi or android’s web sites tyo buy or browse. If buyers are like me web presence is meaningless. You feel its important so am i unusual in this respect?

  4. betterskills Says:

    My point isn’t the medium – it’s that now there are many more options and much more competition. With a name like Sandoz – it’s clear you’re not jumping on the Tattooed Banker. But for those people who believe that the TV brands offer quality to rival the major brands, their dollars will follow the lowest price and if they have a favorite brand, that’s one less person buying an Ingersol or XO or Stauer on Shop. Now without Skelton the fanboi element may be gone; we’re not going to know until VVTV reports quarterly results – but the last report clearly showed a decrease in sales. Is that because of scandal? I for one believe WG is the audience that purchases the majority of SNBC stock but re continued weakness in the US economy could also be a factor – but that doesn’t explain the rise in sales of other product categories. One would have to think, at some point, that people will stop buying the same watch over and over again and maybe the osier coupled with the lack of variety from Invicta worked together to erode sales.

    And as I responded to the last post, you have to consider the spread of smartphones. Whoever develops and puts an app out for iOS and Android OS that blends sales and social media will be positioned to be the big winner.

    And while you sir are not active on the Internet, the entire WG fanbase seems to live on it. Where these people ultimately end up will determine who the big winner is.

  5. Twat Waffles Says:

    The TV audience is only, I think buying only TV products, which includes TV watches. If they don’t use the internet well then so what. They want the bargain and not the truth or integrity.

    I think the people using the internet are likely buying better made higher end and medium to higher end luxury watches, watchgeeks aside, I would not buy a Clerc power reserve from the TV, I would use the internet, but I would also verify with Clerc that the place is an authorized retailer which would put me in the Clerc warranty, not some bullshit warranty by the seller.

    Fallout can happen for many reasons, but the catalyst is usually the common! or even scandal. I say whichever vendor leaves Nbc can fuck themselves, go ahead start a internet watch selling website, start a forum for your company, PEOPLE, you are dealing with tainted merchandise from tainted mouths!!

    Economy aside, can’t believe I just said that, TV watch vendors will be replaced by another crap vendor and so on, and if it’s affordable and price slashed, and the salesman spewed their pitch properly, then dumb people will buy and buy some more. Look how transparently overly excited Nbc salesman are about Ingersoll, Stauer, Jowissa, Ed Hardy, on and fucking on, I don’t care if the internet one day trumps the TV, my feelings are they deserve what they get, the ONLY thing that is important is the truth!

    Maybe these scandalous business people need to go to Europe and eat a salad with sprouts, Mmmmm, hey watch douche’s, how about some ecoli with peppercorn ranch dressing?

  6. john Says:

    It seems that most people who bash invicta and shop nbc, are like snobs who think think that all of us who watch shop nbc and buy invicta are stupid. I do both so I am one of the stupid people. I am a collector who also has had omega and other such high end brands in my collection. I also have a college degree, so I am stupid on a higher level. First, shop nbc job is to sell watches, and that they do very well. Invicta and anddroid have given many people the oppoturnity to own watches, because many people can afford these watches . They can buy watches for 3 hundred instead of 3 thousand dollars. So tell me who is the fool here? A 7750 movement stock costs 4 hundred dollars, and you pay 3 to 5 grand, for a watch with with that movement in it, you tell me who is the fool here? Take a gaze in the mirror.

  7. Twat Waffle Says:

    John John John…what can I say except the following facts for you to read, since you have a college degree (wow), this should be easy for you to comprehend…I hope.

    Those Valjioux 7750’s that are housed inside an Invicta timepiece are made to be affordable because they DO NOT retain any STREET VALUE whatsoever and they pump em out like water, here’s an example college boy…take an Invicta w/7750 and take an Omega w/7750 or any other HIGH END company and here’s what you have…your high end watch RETAINS it’s VALUE why your Invicta DOES NOT…elementary Twatson!!!…err…Watson.

    Now college boy, let’s look in the mirror together, keep collecting your Invicta’s because they are ONLY collectible to the owner, not the real world. Now take your Omega’s, Maurice LaCroix’s, Longines, Ebel’s, Iwc’s, Panerai’s, Ulysse Nardine’s, Perellet’s and REALIZE you get what you pay for.

    John, answer this question, is a Sapphire crystal more desirable than a Flame Fusion crystal?

    Are Isa and Ronda movements more desirable than ETA’S?

    Are you that impressed with Invicta’s Swiss gold layering?…how many microns??

    Do you like wearing timepiece’s that almost EVERYBODY owns?

    Would you rather own a modified Valgrange from Invicta or one from the high end brands I mentioned above??

    It’s okay to like Tv watches John, admitting it is difficult…lol

    John, if one of your BELOVED Invicta’s need service I hope you have 3 months to spare in order to get your watch back, that’s not saying much after the sale.

    John, do you know that television salesman and overly aggressive watch vendors know the right VOCABULARY or sales pitch and to say certain things to make it look like an incredible deal??

    Coleen Lopez (tv host) said it best many years ago, “we can sell dirt and they would buy it”, must be collectible dirt with a flame fusion crystal for $200 on 6 vp’s…lolololol

    John, maybe a revelation for ya, maybe not, you see there are watch collectors that are WILLING to pay for Swiss Made minute repeater’s, perpetual calender’s, Tourbillon’s, regulator’s, and there are collectors that would rather own a modified 2824 from Edox than a 2824 from Invicta, or Deep Blue, or Croton, or Swiss Legend, Jaques Leman’s….infinity!

    John, if you desire more reality from Twat Waffles all you have to do is write another unintelligent comment and I will be more than happy to SCHOOL ya!!!!

    Not even bashing Invicta, just showing you that you don’t know what your talking about.

    Your probably the type of collector that would rather have a cheap winder from ShopNbc rather than a real one, enjoy your watches!!!

    By the way, nobody insures their Invicta’s unless their as delusional as you are, as soon as you purchase an Invicta you lost money/value pal!!!

    Maybe you should try, they have all the Chinese food you want…egg roll to go with your Sea-Gull panini???

    Class Dismissed


  8. krane11367 Says:

    There is obviously a reason why hookers’ customers are called Johns.

    It’s absolutely fine to collect, well, anything; many village idiots collect pieces of lint, dead birds,pre-chrewed gum, you name it. It’s a free world, do whatever it is you like.

    But those are choose to ignore facts and continiue to deal with the shady, the slimy, and the poor quality of that one-eyed bandit calld the Tee Vee? I do hope they continue to keep buying, and keep wearing Invicta watches. Who else can we point, laugh at, and avoid at shopping malls and other public gatherings? In all seriousness, the same crowd that chooses to buy Snuggies, Kevin Trudeau books, Shamwows, Invicta Watches, and Mighty Putty are all one in the same – its the ones who walk around dressed in yellow boxes as Invicta SAN IIIs at Halloween parties that are the real head-scratchers.

    Like guys who buy $10 hairpieces off magazine adss, wear pink shirts and purple pants, and never, ever get a date – some people just don’t and never will get it. So let ’em eat Akulas. But don’t blame the rest of the free world for thinking “What the fuck is wrong with that moron?”

  9. Twat Waffles Says:

    I guess John John has gone bye bye after leaving his college level opine with us.

    Talk about a smart man with a frivolous watch collection…John?…you there??

    He’s probably typing to on when the new Swiss parts 5040D with the 13 inter-change neon straps SubNoma 12 is available to add to his collection of Invicta’s and Adee Kaye’s and his 1 Omega!!

    Or…he could be talking to Invicta Ryan or Invicta Mike and Tim T giving them an astounding live on-air testimonial on how his jeweler (Kim-Fong Jewelers) couldn’t believe the money he paid for a Valjoux Noma that’s the Elabore adjusted to 3 positions!!

    John loves the following sentences:

    1- “Folks, this is last call, please use to place your orders, operators are jammed”.

    2- “You really, REALLY need to pick this one up guys”.

    3- “Surgical grade stainless steel”.

    4- “High tech ceramic and tungsten so COLLECTIBLE with the Swiss parts Isa 8171”.

    5- “Swiss gold layering bonded at the Molecular level”.

    6- “Flame fusion crystal providing you with the properties of mineral and sapphire”.

    7- “Only a half dozen in the red, you must pull the trigger now!”.

    8- “I will tell you that we’ve adapted our Swiss gold layering into this piece, into this caliber and design element and product”.

    Look, it’s Avi Viera from Renato, I thought she was modeling watches on JTV with Temple, now she has joined forces with Temple at Nbc, look John (college boy), did you buy your XO???

    John…did you buy your Wildebeast, Buzo, Beast, Mostro??…real nice huh…sapphire coated mineral crystal with a Valjoux??..who’s the genius?

    John also fancy’s the following:

    1- Ronda

    2- Lalo

    3- Invicta pavillion

    4- Invicta horseback riding

    5- Scuba, Leviathan, pro diver, Lupah

    And lastly…College John is proud to live the “Invicta Lifestyle”, where we all give our money via value pays to some rich yellow dude while sitting back relaxing thinking we are part of something were really not.

    hahahahaha hahahahahaha hahahahah brahahahahaha

    Thank you John for the entertainment!!


  10. Penis Muffins Says:

    Hello everybody.

    I hope John is going to watch tonight’s horological comedy known as “Live From The Invicta Pavillion”.

    John probably has a semi-boner just thinking about all the tempting “once only’s”, and high pressure aggressive selling tactics.

    Or, they might do a dog & pony show live at the “Invicta Grotto”, where yellow Invicta elves turn pork buns into wine.

    Or John might be stretching his nasty noodle as a warm up while he strokes it to the beat of the world’s most famous/non famous 3 hour watch block called WOW, John probably has quite a few Swiss Legend’s in his collection and is probably a dedicated member….his other member is in his other hand folks.

    Enjoy your non valuable heavily discounted 3rd party warrantied watches!!

  11. Ass Munchies Says:

    Has anybody seen the new Stuhrling Prestige?


    Valjoux’s that start with “ST” finished in Swiss…blahblahblah.

    Such a joke, such comedy, such crap on Tv.

    Just like Stuhrling Originals with ST movements, TY Chinese based crappola!!

    They got the kid that used to represent Swiss Legend selling these, this guy all he does is try to crack jokes, sucks his lips on camera, and worst of all he’s got a voice that sounds like fucking sandpaper…just plain awful!!!

    Want to laugh even harder, watch Rick Kalina and his Jean Marcels, this man acts like god is his watchmaker…lmao!!!

    ShopNbc is simply the FUNNIEST shit on television, better than those trillion self indulgent transparent shallow reality shows that flood every channel.

    Oh yeah, and if you watch WOW its even more comedy as they try to sell their crap, my gosh, between nbc and wow its like a double shot of funny crap, if you need a laugh I highly recommend these shows.

  12. Trevor Says:

    Holy crap a guy can get roasted here hard …..I must say i do own one android antigravity with a seagull movement . I simply picked it up because it had a saphire crystal , great lume, tungsten case, but most of all because i liked the look of it…..Does it hold street value?…Of course not. I do however think its odd that it is more accurate than my Breitling super avenger, and my Victorinox alpnach. Both of wich have been recently serviced…Also find it sort of funny how people compliment, and oogle over my Android more so than my much higher end swiss made pieces….I realize most of them are probably not horologically gifted but who cares….

    At the end of the day i say wear and collect what you like…I realize the higher end brands hold better value but you can still find highly discounted prices on watch recon for ultra high end pre-owned brands.

    Peace out Peeps!!!!!

  13. Penis Pancake Says:

    Trevor Trevor Trevor…

    I must say, what a diplomatic/neutral bunch of paragraphs you left us, impressive….NOT!!!!

    Let me tell you something, NO WAY IN HELL does your 3hz TY movement keep better time than a certified chronometer or just a regular 4hz Swiss movement (claro 888 aside lol), the only way your TY movement keeps better time, is probably because those other watches the TY out performs need servicing. Dope!!!

    TY movements suck, their the weakest thinnest mass produced pieces of so called metal ever stuck inside a case!

    Android is just another TV vendor, if you notice, Wing Liang might be a great guy which is true, but his watches all look the same, have the same accents on the bezels, and are good watches to beat the living daylights out of, they are a a step-up from a Timex Expedition with Indiglo…..LMFAO!!!!!!!

    …Also, Android has so many cases that have sharp edges and look like a CNC machine barely touched it.

    Trevor, enjoy your Seagull pie, and I’m sure your going to purchase their Seagull minute repeater and perpetual calender, because according to Trevor, Seagull is more accurate than his Brietling and Victorinox….hahahahahahahahahahahaha

    Trevor, you must of purchased your Brietling and Victorinox from the grey market and not an Authorized Retailer.

    Trevor, your not getting roasted, as much as I would like to, but please be careful about comparing a Brietling to a Seagull, it just makes you look like an uninformed schmuck who’s probably a nice dude.

    Peace bro!

  14. Bunghole Bungalow Says:

    Way to go (Ass Munchies), you are correct about Rick Kalina and his Jean Marcels.

    I saw him on the shop a few times, his last time on air he was very clearly putting down Patek Philippe, he said they haven’t changed their case design in over 50 yrs, very pompous old man.

    You would think a little hobbit like Kalina would at least possess enough hobbit brain matter and tact not to put down Patek, but I guess these barkers will say anything to make the viewer part with his or her money.

    What a loser!

  15. Krane Jr. Says:

    I wish Krane would leave his usual witty and quite funny comments.

    Between Krane and Twat Waffles and Betterskills and a few others, this site should be banging, instead it’s like a funeral home.

    With guys like Kalina, Skelton, Lior, Swiss Federation, Stuhrling, I can keep going, this is prime for many many laughs and truths.

    If you want to see pure audacity and pure pompous attitude (plus comedy) , then I also say watch Jean Marcel, what a complete moron, he’s got way too much starch in his shirt.


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